Is Nintendo unknowingly held to higher standards?

stealth toilet said:
Beanie mentioned something about how to get an unbiased view of a game, i.e. WW, by pretending it was made by another company. Sorry, but for me that isn't gonna work. I bought WW because of the experience that Nintendo gave me with OOT, and I was expecting WW to provide something along those lines.
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That's kinda missing the point of what I was saying. But yes, you are right, it won't work unless you're willing to give it a try. I mentioned trying to view it as a standalone piece of software to possibly stop your view of the game being clouded by expectations and your prejudgements based on who has made the game.

stealth toilet said:
I couldn't play WW pretending that I never played OOT, simply because I bought my GC with the Zelda franchise as one of my reasons for doing so. In a way I guess you could say I felt as though Nintendo owed me for investing in them. I dunno, whatever the reason, I do hold Nintendo to higher standards, and I expect them to cater to what I want, even if it's unrealistic.
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Then you're setting yourself up for disappointment. But that's your choice, of course ;)
 
Dang. Timeless point, mai. If we had a "Best Of" section, this would be in it.

As for being held to a higher standard, I don't think that's quite it. I believe that gamers expect Nintendo to be unique in their approach. From the NES to the Wii, there was something that made them different.
 
No, she hit the nail on the head. They say, "Get some new stuff, change things." Then they do and get, "Why'd you change it, the old was fine?" Either that, or their change will be called a gimmick. But then that gets proven wrong in about a year and everyone who said it feels dumb.
 
Dart said:
Dang. Timeless point, mai. If we had a "Best Of" section, this would be in it.
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Well, I try. :D That actually sounds like an interesting idea, though.

On topic, I still find myself struggling with this issue. I like that Nintendo is unique, but now I find that I don't have a problem with something that's more of the same as long as it also adds some new elements. Halo 3 IMO is a great example. The gameplay is pretty much the same as Halo 2, but they added new weapons and features such as Theater Mode. I think it may be just as good if a game takes what is already there and improves upon it, as it is to take what already works and change it.
 
Strubes said:
The same can be said about every company though.
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No one was clamoring for Final Fantasy, or Halo to change things up. Honestly, I can't think of any non-Nintendo franchises that have people screaming for change, then going crazy as soon as it comes. Then, as we see with Twilight Princess, keeping it the same makes people just as angry.
 
Mai Valentine said:
There were people that were upset that Final Fantasy XII wasn't turn-based, though.
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True, but there really weren't many Final Fantasy fans, asking for Final Fantasy to change its combat. Had they not changed, I don't think they would have received a lot of flak, or at least not the amount Twilight Princess seemed to get.
 
Twilight Princess was Nintendo falling to inferior(as opposed to peer) pressure from OoT fanboys.
 
Homicidal Cherry53 said:
True, but there really weren't many Final Fantasy fans, asking for Final Fantasy to change its combat. Had they not changed, I don't think they would have received a lot of flak, or at least not the amount Twilight Princess seemed to get.
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Actually, there were a lot of Final Fantasy fans asking for change, and so they got it. Now in FFXII it's either a love or hate game. Nintendo isn't held to higher standards. Just the fact that the Cube didn't go well, made Nintendo fans think the world's against them. They're paranoid. Then they go trash other consoles. It's all hypocritical.
 
Strubes said:
Actually, there were a lot of Final Fantasy fans asking for change, and so they got it. Now in FFXII it's either a love or hate game. Nintendo isn't held to higher standards. Just the fact that the Cube didn't go well, made Nintendo fans think the world's against them. They're paranoid. Then they go trash other consoles. It's all hypocritical.
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We're not talking about Nintendo fanboys and other consoles. We're talking about their reaction to Nintendo's own games, and it seems like whether they change things (Wind Waker), or keep them the same (Twilight Princess), they recieve flak from something.
 
I still stand by the idea that Nintendo is changing what they should keep the same and keeping what they should change. Ex. style of graphics.

I don't think that people are at fault for not liking a game. I realize that's the debatable point, but ultimately there have been good sequels that were very well received by critics and the public at large. While some people may have been disappointed with OOT because of the experience they had with ALTTP, nearly everyone felt the series took a giant leap forward. The same cannot be said of WW. In each case people had preset expectations on what the game should be based off of previous games in that series, but it was only in one instance that people found it let them down.

I could rattle off a list of game sequels that blew away audiences who were new to the series as well as those who had followed it for some time. If one developer can do it, then we must admit it is possible for all developers to do. Should everyone be soft on Nintendo just because they've had some gems in the past? Of course not. If they don't think they can make a Zelda game better than OOT then they should pass off the torch to someone who thinks they might be able to, or at the very least, stop putting the Zelda name on a game that doesn't deserve it just to boost sales.
 
Ha! I was laughing at that last line. Zelda name on a game that doesn't deserve it...classic. They DID think they could make a better OoT and they did(with Majora's Mask). They said Twilight Princess was much better, and a lot of critics did, too. Fans, not so much.
 
i think that too many people think since because they did it first, they HAVE to do it best EVERY time, and since they dont, they get shot down constantly
 
fhqwhgads said:
Ha! I was laughing at that last line. Zelda name on a game that doesn't deserve it...classic. They DID think they could make a better OoT and they did(with Majora's Mask). They said Twilight Princess was much better, and a lot of critics did, too. Fans, not so much.
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Fans = what matters
Critics = not so much

Nintendo isn't held to higher standards. It's just an excuse for Nintendo fans to feel like they're the underdog in everything.
 
No, I think the point I was trying to originally make is that even though current Nintendo games are still good, Nintendo fans find them lacking because they are comparing them with past games.

Is Twilight Princess really that bad of a game? I doubt it, but for many people it just did not live up to OoT. People who haven't played a Zelda game before are probably enjoying it more because they are not comparing it with past Zelda games. Same thing with Super Mario Sunshine. People who played SM64 didn't like SMS because it wasn't SM64. But imagine someone who had never played SM64 and might have liked SMS.

The point I was trying to make is that even though most Nintendo franchise games are technically good games (they score well with critics) Nintendo fans and gamers in general don't hold them in as high regard because the newer games don't compare to older games in the same franchise. Thus, higher standards. Nintendo fans go into it expecting a game that is 10x times better then the game before it, and when it doesn't do that, even if it's a great game, it is not seen as being as good.
 
I think that's somewhat because the big ones(OoT, Sm64) were all standard. Mario had no FLUDD, Link had no transforming Masks.
 
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